Systemic Team Coaching in Healthcare:
Helping Teams Think Within the System

Transforming Healthcare Coaching Podcast — Episode 112: Teams Thinking Within the System with Gillian Faith. Host Klaus Grim, PA-C CPC ELI-MP interviews Transforming Healthcare Coaching® coach Gillian Faith, MS ACC SHRM-SCP CPQC. Published June 8, 2026.

Gillian Faith: Blame is never really healthy. Shifting to curiosity is a way to help move away from that mindset of blame because sometimes we don't know the whole story, we don't understand the whole picture.

Klaus Grim: The power of systemic team coaching is inviting those voices that are oftentimes hidden, and breaking a lot of the hierarchical system.

Gillian Faith: We can't have strong effective leadership without wellbeing. The two go hand-in-hand, and we're very astute when it comes to leadership and wellbeing because you can't separate them.

Klaus Grim: Have you ever worked on a team that was doing everything right but still felt stuck? Staffing pressures, policy changes, communication breakdowns between departments, patient flow issues. Sometimes we think the problem's our team when we're actually just bumping into a larger system around us. And so excited to have this episode, Gillian. we haven't been on an episode for quite some time.

Gillian Faith: Yeah, it's been a while.

Klaus Grim: I think, Lilly's had a few guests, which had some amazing guests on the podcast. And behind the scenes, Gillian, we've been on a journey to learn more about how we can apply coaching to teams.

Gillian Faith: Yes, we have.

Klaus Grim: And so we've been learning about systemic team coaching, and that's where some of our episodes are going to start to lean towards is to help healthcare leaders and professionals and organizations see things from a different lens, from a systemic lens. And so for this episode, we're going to talk about how teams think within the greater system in which they work. And so Gillian, I'd love to start off this episode just to talk about it, about why there are so many challenges that healthcare teams have. What are some of the bigger ones that you see?

Gillian Faith: Yes, so good question, and it's also a big question, you know? when I first started working in healthcare and some of the issues that I came across and some of the challenges in, doing what the patients needed, they basically always boiled down to communication issues. So I think that's one of the biggest things for teams. And, teams are everywhere in healthcare, there's teams in every department, every division, and, patient care gets complex, Especially, you work in emergency medicine, so yours is particularly complex and, life and death situations, and, decisions that, are, very, very important. So, working as part of a team can be very rewarding, and the results that we achieve together can be extremely, significant. But there's always challenges with communication usually. Sometimes it's alignment. not everybody's thinking the same. And sometimes it's, people don't always feel comfortable with the people on the team they're working with, because there's hierarchies in healthcare. So, having that psychological safety on teams is sometimes, an issue that I see.

Klaus Grim: Yeah. I think you touched on the stem of teams and challenges is communication and another thing that just popped up to my mind was, as you mentioned, there are so many different teams we are involved in, I think of my own work, right? I have my department team, I have my, student leadership team, I have my, teams within patient care, And those are constantly shifting and adapting. And so, thinking of ourselves in teams in many different aspects can sometimes help, I think, better understand about where we stand among these teams and who we want to show up as each time. and so I think, understanding that model, that, teams are complex and there are so many challenges and as you just mentioned, when it comes to teams, in healthcare environments specifically, and I think if we can touch base on the communication aspect, how we show up and how we want to talk with our other colleagues, other team members, I think we are at agency to make the changes that we're looking to make, in the best way possible. So when we think of teams, why do you think it's such a challenge for healthcare teams specifically to see themselves as part of the greater healthcare landscape, the greater healthcare system? Because I think that is a often a hard challenge for a lot of, healthcare professionals, who are working the front lines, for instance, where it is really hard to see things outside of what they see.

Gillian Faith: Yeah. And if you think back to the training that everybody, no matter what specialty you're in, whatever clinical specialty, the emphasis is always on the patient, It's always on doing the best for the patient, whatever that is. So that becomes the focus, and, I think, I feel like the teams just form around that. They form around the needs of the particular specialty. So the teams are adapting to what they need to do for that patient at that time. So it makes sense to me that would be, where the team's focus goes and the dynamics, the team dynamics, the team makeup, the team synergy becomes secondary because it has to. But the other thing that really stands out for me as with any teams, especially in healthcare, is everybody's depending on each other, the physicians are depending on the nursing staff and the, all the different services, the pharmaceuticals, e- everything. sometimes we can't progress to the next step without the help of another team member. So there's all these interdependencies.

Klaus Grim: Yeah. And I think it's- Very hard because healthcare is challenging. the roles that we have in any department, in any specialty, in any role within healthcare has its own unique challenges, and sometimes that energy that a lot of people bring into healthcare, they're upset, they're overworked, they're exhausted, they're burnt out, and it's only natural because of maybe the lack of support or the, inability or the difficulty to, make shifts in your life and in your work to be more well, difficult. And so, I think that plays a big role into why it's harder to see the bigger system as well, is when you have that colleague right next to you who's constantly saying, "I don't know how much longer I can do this for," or, "I'm calling out sick tomorrow. This is ridiculous. This person is the cause of this. This, this leadership is that." when there's that constant what we call kind of catabolic energy, I find that it's much more challenging to see things from a more anabolic lens to, to really see that there is possibility in making shifts, and you have that possibility. I find frontline professionals, who maybe don't hold a leadership title find it tough to make or offer solutions or changes that could impact patient care, wellbeing in the team that they're in, and they're afraid to speak up. And so this is why it's we're opening these conversations of how to view things from more a systemic lens.

Gillian Faith: Yeah. And when I think of leadership, I think of three different levels, we're always in charge of how we lead ourselves. absolutely some some days are not going to go the way we planned or we're dealing with something really stressful, and we're not going to show up the way we would like to because we're dealing with something. But on a more normal basis, leading ourselves and showing up as we would expect and hope that our other team members would is very important. And, we talk about mirror neurons and, if I show up grumpy, you know that's going to affect how you are. and, you mentioned energy leadership. That's part of the initial coach training that Klaus and I did, and, that talks about the catabolic energy, and we don't want to stay in these states for very long because they pull us down, and they pull other people down. And we want to try and be in those more anabolic states because they're more uplifting. And, think about How good you feel when somebody does something, either, they do something for you or they just talk to you in a way that's meaningful and it really lifts you up and it really helps your day go, much better than it might have done

Klaus Grim: Yeah. Just like I mentioned how, that toxic or destructive energy can be contagious, so can the other opposite,

Gillian Faith: Absolutely, yeah.

Klaus Grim: and this is not to say that we are the only way, that changes are going to happen in healthcare, but, system level changes have to happen as well. They need to be paired together. There's no question about that. But oftentimes we like to speak to your agency to help yourself right now because all these skills that you gain from communication and, finding ways to stay well, only affect you as you move on in your career, but also in your personal life. A lot of these, skills and these, developments are equal. They f- they follow both aspects. So, I love to, bring that to people's attention that when you work on yourself, you're not just helping yourself in your career, but you're helping yourself forever in your personal life as well. And so in a lot of stressed healthcare environments, we find teams often are blaming themselves or other departments, maybe leadership. How do we maybe shift towards more curiosity instead of just blame?

Gillian Faith: Yeah, and blame is tough, right? Because if we're placing blame on a person or a team, it's hard to get to a more positive state where we can actually either learn from it or shift it. So Blame is never really healthy. shifting to curiosity is a way to help move away from that mindset of blame because sometimes we don't know the whole story. we don't understand the whole picture. So, we can be quick to blame, But if we can stop and pause and think, well, what else might be happening in that situation, or what else might that person be dealing with right now, and open the conversation up to things like, can you help me understand how that situation played out today, w- whatever it is. and I think when we have curiosity and we're asking questions We're going to get much more information coming back.

Klaus Grim: Yeah.

Gillian Faith: maybe so- an error's been made, and it couldn't have been prevented, but we have to learn from that, and we have to approach that with curiosity. How can we prevent that happening in the future? And what have we learned, and what do we need to change, going forward?

Klaus Grim: Yeah. And none of this is easy. And Gillian, you're a trained mediator as well, so you have a lot of, knowledge and experience in some of these probably challenges that happen with, individuals and teams. And one thing that I do more often, which is still extremely challenging, is when you start to get maybe a little upset and grumbling inside, where you want to say, "They're the cause of me," or they're the cause of something that's going on with you. Just take a pause, three seconds, Instead of being just reactive, that a lot of people do, which is completely normal. But taking that pause and saying, and just using that word curiosity, Like, what else could be going on, so that may require asking powerful questions in a professional way, Not an accusatory way, not in a blaming way, but, what's going on here that could be another way that, that could be the reason that, I'm feeling this way, or the situation is happening. And Gillian, I think we always go back to the kind of, PQ background that you have about how, sometimes just thinking that, when you think you're right in a situation, that the other party may be 10% correct, And what is that 10%? I always try and think that way. And then also, what challenges is that other person or team having that could be the reason why we are being impacted in the way that we are? Right. And how do we open the room to say, "Hey, we are both struggling here-" "maybe. What can we do different together that we couldn't do apart," I think-

Gillian Faith: Exactly, yes.

Klaus Grim: Yes... these are very powerful ways of seeing things. But it's not easy. It's not easy to take that pause.

Gillian Faith: No. it's not easy, and you're dealing with challenging situations, and there's emotions involved, and, there's lots at stake. So yeah, absolutely, it's not easy. But, there are better ways, than some of the ways that we're communicating with team members and teams are communicating with each other. And because remember, we're all interdependent, right? As a team member, you're dependent on the other person, and as a team, you're also dependent on other teams in the organization. So there's lots of interdependencies going on. There's lots of different education and skills all coming into play.

Klaus Grim: Yeah. And I think that goes into a little bit of what we do as systemic team coaches is, right, is opening those doors. So say you're part of one specific team and you're having challenges with maybe another team within that organization, we like to open that door to say, "Be curious. What could be going on with them? How could you have those conversations? Can we have those conversations?" Right? And how do we do that in a way that is professional, but at the same time, how does that, help your, your greater, systemic network, the patients you care for, the frontline professionals that are, there every single day, acting on your policies and changes, and then your greater, leadership and then the greater healthcare, system? how are we supporting all of that, and how are we interwoven, and how do we lead in a way that is keeping us well? because, as we all know, healthcare is extremely challenging, both on the front lines, within the leadership, even for patient care, right? So how do we create a model that supports everybody in that dynamic, is important to think about

Gillian Faith: Yeah, and what is coming up for me as you're talking is, sometimes you can't see the wood from the trees, When you're part of that team or, your team being part of the larger organization, sometimes it's hard to stand back and look at things more objectively, and that's where having, team coaches like the services that we provide, where you've got a neutral third party coming in, who's experienced in clinical matters and healthcare environments. we can come in with a different lens, and we can see things that other people who are part of teams don't have the privilege of seeing.

Klaus Grim: Yeah. I think you bring up a really good point that a lot of healthcare teams are not familiar with, whether it be a coach or a consultant coming in and saying, "I'm just here to listen, and I'm here to support and help you see things." Because when you're stuck in the weeds- and you've never experienced this way of slowing down to speed up, or this way of having a guided approach- with somebody who has this experience working with teams but also healthcare as well- and I think that's what makes our team quite unique, Gillian, is, from practicing frontline, in the emergency room as a PA. You have strong experience in occupational therapy, healthcare leadership, HR, mediation. The list goes on with you. and then Lilly, who's obviously full-time practicing as a critical care ER physician as well with leadership roles and simulation and, the founder of Transforming Healthcare Coaching. And so we have such a breadth of experience and as well as shared input to making sure all voices are heard within a room. And I think that's the power of systemic team coaching, is inviting those voices that are oftentimes hidden, and breaking a lot of the hierarchical system because as we know in healthcare in any profession, is that there's a lot of hierarchy, And how do we create a system where, team leaders may not feel like they, are this hierarchical person, but, it's being viewed as a team member. How do we foster a system that says, "Hey, I'm here with you. I want your voice to be heard so that we can collectively, be proud of, the team that we are and make the shifts and changes that are all agreed upon and all supported and all moving the needle towards the, the powerful high-value team, creating team that we want to be"?

Gillian Faith: Yeah. And when you're saying that, I'm thinking of psychological safety as well. And because of the hierarchies, there's lots of team where absolutely people do feel comfortable speaking up or, saying when they think that something's not going the way it should be. But there's also teams that don't have that psychological safety where people are afraid to speak up because they fear that they will be, the, viewed negatively or, made fun of or whatever. So, but what that does is it stifles creative thoughts and, thinking about things in a different way. So psychological safety for teams is very important, and it comes from the leader usually, The leaders have to be able to create that space where it's okay to admit that something didn't go the way they planned, and it's also okay for the leader to, to communicate that they don't always have all the answers. Some leaders think that they have to have all the answers, or they have to put out all the fires, and they have to, fix things. But actually, in today's modern leadership world, that is not the case. And, leaders who show up with, a more authentic kind of approach and who foster the psychological safety culture and admit they don't know everything actually Seem to have the healthier teams, the stronger teams

Klaus Grim: Yeah. I think we've talked about this in depth, psychological safety in healthcare, and I think we can link a episode below. I think Lillian created an episode on it with Amy, Edmondson,

Gillian Faith: kind of- Did the, the research, yeah, in hospitals, and she found that the teams who were higher performing were the ones that made more mistakes, not less mistakes. The trick being that they talked about it and they learned from the mistakes, and the team became stronger as a result.

Klaus Grim: Yeah. And we're all human, right? We're all human- Totally... in healthcare, and- Totally... mistakes happen, and how do we learn from them so they don't happen again? and how can we constantly improve on the process? And some team members may feel more psychologically safe to speak up, right? A, they've maybe have more seniority. They've been there for a long period of time, and they feel like their voice can be heard, right?

Gillian Faith: Mm-hmm.

Klaus Grim: And the hard part is you sometimes have new members who are joining in, right? Or you, there may have been a shift or a challenge in their healthcare environment or even their personal life that's just made it more difficult for them to speak up. And so it's very important, what I've learned in all this team coaching that I've been through, is having to speak up about psychological safety. It has to be spoken out, and it has to be reinforced by the team, What is it that would support you to feel comfortable in having a voice in our team to speak up about anything, is important to say out loud and write down so we have a charter- to go off of to say, "In a moment where I'm feeling not psychologically safe, how do we go back to that?" And I think that's important as a team because some of the greatest, shifts that you can have are from the voices that are sometimes being quiet because they just don't feel- safe to speak up.

Gillian Faith: Absolutely, and you're right. systemic team coaching helps bring all the voices into the room, and, I think as a result, it's a healthier situation

Klaus Grim: Yeah. I think we can all speak to, I think teams are missing out on some of those silent voices that are a part of meetings. Or they may be challenged by one member who's always challenging the meetings, I think we talked about the silent person who doesn't feel comfortable speaking up, but it- you might have somebody who speaks up too much in a way that's not al- inviting other voices into the room, or, maybe, more, I guess, negative, in the way that they speak. And sometimes th- that's your greatest person as well, in a team. but how do we make it so it's a more productive meeting where it's not accusatory, where it's more productive, I think, part of what we do as systemic team coaches is to help see the different dynamics happening within the team, and how to empower each member within the team to speak up in a way that is productive for the team, Right to kind of achieve that their, their goals or their, KPIs.

Gillian Faith: and sometimes the team gets into habits, Where it's just, it's normal for that person who talks all the time to talk all the time. and it's normal for the person who's often quiet to continue to be quiet. So, having a systemic team coach there can help bring some awareness to the dynamics that are actually going on in the room. And, sometimes they're going to be really good, and you want to build on that, and o- other times there's going to be habits or behaviors that we want to, bring awareness to, and they might want to change the way that they handle these things.

Klaus Grim: Yeah. And I think inviting somebody who's not part of your team into meetings, opens up some challenges in its own, that need to contract for psychological safety is there again if it hasn't been done yet. So there might be an opportunity there, number one. but it's challenging to now have somebody else in the room. it can- Yeah... I can imagine for some team members it may be coming off across as, what do we need to be fixed? Are we the problem? And sometimes it may feel like it's bringing more tension. And one thing I like to tell people when we engage with their teams is that, it is challenging to have one of us in the room. We're going to ask very powerful questions. We're going to name some of the emotions that are coming through, why is everybody quiet right now? Like, what just came up? what are we hiding right now that could be beneficial for your team leader to hear, you may never have wanted to name or specify out loud. And it's going to be hard for the team leader as well. it's not like you have, invite somebody in, and all of a sudden you're transformed. It takes work. It takes work. but it's good work. It's work that will leave you empowered and ready to tackle future issues as a team collectively again in the future. And then as well as, I think, there's an individual perspective, too, To being able to pause, not be reactive, to see things from a more systemic lens oftentimes carries over into their individual work as clinicians, and their own individual leaders', their own individual leadership in personal lives.

Gillian Faith: Yeah. And one thing I loved about systemic team coaching is it's future-focused, So people like that. And it's outside in, so what do all these stakeholder groups need from our team? So- Outside in, in future focus, and I think that's very powerful

Klaus Grim: I think it extremely is, and I think that's what I valued about coaching from the start when I first got into this role was the idea that I love to envision, and I love to move in a forward direction. But how do I do so in a productive way that I'm not getting so distracted with all the other things that I'm doing, And how do I do in a way that I also stay well, and I enjoy the process, and I think that carries over to what we do as a sy- systemic team coaches is we don't want it to be a boring process where you just have us in the room in your team meetings. We want to actually have some fun with it. We want you to feel stronger as a team, safe as a team, and really create that high value, not just for the greater system, but for yourselves to feel like- you're proud of the work that you're doing- Right... if you're not already, feeling that way, And if you're not, I would also say you are already doing it. You are already creating amazing work. working in healthcare in itself, though it is challenging, you are doing something that a lot of people cannot do and really trust on you. and you're oftentimes doing it with limited resources that other professions have. And so I would like to applaud all the healthcare teams that are listening to this already.

Gillian Faith: Absolutely, yeah.

Klaus Grim: Yeah.

Gillian Faith: There's a heck of a lot of good work going on everywhere.

Klaus Grim: Yeah. Every single day. Yeah. And I think we need to be proud of that, but then also see things from a different lens. How can we continue this work without burning out, and to really, find joy in this process every single day, I think is what everybody maybe wants, Is just to feel proud going to work, joyful, and knowing that the work that they do is empowering.

Gillian Faith: Yeah. And two other things are coming up for me. And as coaches, whether we're working with individuals or teams, it's always about moving the action forward. We're always looking to make advances and, depending on what that is for the individual or the team. And the other thing that's coming up for me is we can't have strong, effective leadership without wellbeing. The two go hand-in-hand, and we're very astute when it comes to leadership and wellbeing because you can't separate them.

Klaus Grim: No. So

Gillian Faith: how do we make that work for the team members, the team leaders, and all the stakeholders, and all the patient groups that they serve?

Klaus Grim: Yeah. I think that's what makes us very unique as well is that we always keep those two in mind, You can be a great leader, and you probably are already a great leader, but you may be struggling- Both personally and in your career, you're not well. So how do we keep it, real. We keep that your leadership and your wellbeing go hand in hand. You need to feel comfortable going to work knowing that you are taking care of yourself in the process. I think that is a wish everybody has, and I think that is a lens that we keep into perspective, in everything that we do.

Gillian Faith: Yeah. And everybody benefits.

Klaus Grim: Totally. And then when we model that as leaders, oftentimes those that we lead are feeling empowered to feel the same way, and just a last thing. if you feel like this might be a challenge, you're a healthcare leader here where, your team may see this as, "Oh, you're coming in here to fix us." Do you think, I would empower you to think from a different lens as well here and say maybe your team's actually saying, "Wow, you're wanting to invest in us." Ah,

Gillian Faith: love that.

Klaus Grim: And to see things that, we couldn't see together, and also it's opening up that vulnerability to say to your team that, "I want to help me within our team as well." So, we'd love to have further discussions, Gillian. Right now we are offering team coaching for a really low pro bono price just for our assessments, but we don't have too many teams slots available. so if this is intriguing you, we invite you to book a call at transforminghealthcarecoaching.com. You can book with Lillian, our founder, and we'd love to hear, what are some of the challenges you're having, what solutions, does your team need, and what do you need? and we'd love to open that discussion.

Gillian Faith: Very good.

Klaus Grim: Awesome. Well, Gillian, thanks so much for joining us on this episode. Thank you. Hopefully we come back to another episode soon. And, we'd love to hear in the comments what is it that your team may be struggling with, and we'd love to open the doors to some future episodes where we can address some of them more personally. So thank you everybody for listening in, if you're listening in, and we'll see you next week.

Gillian Faith: Thanks, Klaus